30th April 2007
We are so thankful for all the phone calls and emails we have received in support of our stand against spiritual abuse and our desire for proactive action to educate, inform and seek healing for the abusers and those they abuse. We wish we were able to print every email and the text of the many phonecalls we have received. Somebody just reminded us " they say that one letter represents 100 who could write a similar perspective - scary, isn't it?" We are so thankful for the one in a hundred who do take the effort to write often under painful circumstances. We hope eventually to hear from pastors/ministers who have gone through a process of being an admitted abuser to being healed of their pain and deep insecurity.
Barry & Jennifer Pendergast hope they can meet in person many of the visitors to this site. be assured they are not into church bashing only the kind of reform that opens honest debate on abuse within the church, how to stop it and how to heal the abusers and abusees. They are fortunally back in a loving church and able to be productive in ministry again. Praise God! They would be happy to share their experiences and hope for better things at any Christian event. They have a story that needs to be heard. They would hope just a few churches and Christian organisations would embrace the idea of a formal sign at their front doors that clearly states no bullying or any form of abuse beyond these doors and a reference to a policy that outlines how it would be monitored. Please let us know if you go forward with that approach - it will need great courage.
Their thoughts on what constitues "Responsible Follower-ship" in the 21st century church, even in adversity is equally important.
Please let us know if you are willing to have your names/details shown with incoming messages. We are hoping to allow all sides to express their views on church abuse issues. Including the plight of church leaders who suffer abuse at the hands of controlling elders and members. Bleatinglambs.org takes no responsibility for the views expressed unless expressly noted.
From: jeff
Subject: Dealing With Spiritual Abuse
Date: April 30, 2007
To: bleatinglambs@shaw.ca
Speaking out is what started me on the road of healing. It came in
the way of a letter and a conversation or two with people I loved
in the former church. Nothing has come of it but I realize I'm
responsible for me and not my abuser. Sadly, changing a controlling
church culture is a difficult and almost impossible task even in
the best of circumstances. I don't think many people are willing to
put themselves at risk to help the one being hurt because they
themselves are being actively (and perhaps unknowingly) abused
themselves.
I take heart in the fact that I'm different today than I ever was
there. Healing comes because God is good.
Jeff
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From: jgradysr@shaw.ca
Subject: Pastoral Employment Record Disclosure
Date: April 13, 2007 4:49:50 PM MDT
To: bleatinglambs@shaw.ca
I think you disclose anything that you think they’ll find out about anyway – this would include any criminal activity for which you were convicted (excluding traffic tickets) and unethical or immoral behavior for which you were disciplined or created a public scandal. Beyond that you only have a responsibility to give honest answers for the questions they ask – and sometimes the answer might be, “It’s none of your business.”
Jim
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From: (from UK -name witheld by request)
Subject: Spiritual Abuse
Date: April 13, 2007 1:59:39 PM MDT
To: bleatinglambs@shaw.ca
I wish you Gods blessing (from a friend in England ).Having gone through a Spiritual Abuse set up and come through it in Gods time and grace ,it is SO important that Spiritual abuse IS talked about in the established churches it is so subtle that folk are sucked in before they know it ,God has given us integrity and wisdom ,lets use it in humility for his purposes and plans ,I hope we in England can begin to have groups to discuss spiritual abuse openly ,it happens, causing damage and Gods heart must break to see his children in so much pain ,but he does bring us through but we are never the same again ,Every blessing to you both
xxxxxxxx
Bleating Lambs Note - You will see from our home page we are now encouraging readers to set up discussion groups in areas around the world. We will do our best to connect readers to local groups discussing spiritual abuse issues - recovery and prevention.
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We take the opportunity to repeat an email sent to Ron Berg at North American Baptist. When you combine this with the other acts of complicity by Rev Ron Berg,the NABC Representative in Alberta Rev Bob Walthers and South Calgary Pastors, elders and members to prevent fair hearings by the Pendergasts it frankly makes you wonder just how much abuse goes on worldwide to protect abusive leaders! Certainly the evidence on this site suggests a high level of corruption by people who should know and act better. Similar emails were sent to Rev Ron Berg by others without any effect. We trust NABC is now in better hands since the resignation of Rev Berg
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A REQUEST FOR ACTION REV BERG
From: "Ann Blough" <annblough@shaw.ca>
To: <rberg@nabcon.org>
Cc: <kpaj.phillips@shaw.ca>; <kevin.phillips@encana.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 9:23 PM
Subject: A Further Concern re SCCC Elders
Dear Sir,
Months ago you received a request from me to look seriously into the treatment of the Pendergasts by the leadership of SCCC. I did not receive a response.
Please take more care to act on their behalf this time. The harm that is being inflicted upon them by fellow Christians is beyond comprehension. The North -American Baptist Conference you head has a responsibility to safe-guard the reputation of the Lord Jesus. Once leaders of a church under your authority start to destroy the reputations, willfully slander members under their care, deliberately start to intimidate other members who start to question their actions, you have a responsibility to launch an immediate inquiry. Churches who directly violate the biblical guidelines that Jesus taught should not be left in the conference you represent.
The other evening I went as a witness with a member of SCCC to hear her try to receive answers to questions she attempted to raise at a SCCC general meeting in June 2004. Her repeated requests for answers had not been answered in the meantime.
Before I share my observations let me give my background. I came to know Jesus as my personal saviour when I was 14. I am presently a member of Richmond Hill Baptist Church in Calgary. Through the years it was was my privilege to serve on numerous boards and to represent thousands of people as a school trustee, alderman, police commissioner ,etc. In the church I have served in many roles often as chairman. This is given to you not to brag but to let you know I have a good understanding of parliamentary
procedure, constitutions, biblical teachings and how to deal with conflict resolution.
The member and I met two elders, Jim Prichard and Diane Young. We were disappointed that only two elders turned up when it had been promised that there would be four including Pastor Cumberlin. We met in a neutral place - a local A&W. We were pleasantly greeted at first but as the member began to share her questions and concerns she was told by Jim Prichard only he would answer questions and Diane Young would only take notes. This was of concern since Jim Prichard was not an elder when the Pendergasts were first removed from membership and publicly humiliated. The member was told to share what was on her heart and not to read from her notes, and to not to talk or ask about anything else that happened after June 23rd 2004. The manner in which she was given these instructions was belittling.
She made an attempt to explain how she felt about the removal of the Pendergasts and used the word excommunication. WELL, we were informed that we did know not what that word means and that we should go and look it up. (We did later and it means exactly what we thought it meant.) After a couple more rebukes the two elders terminated our meeting and walked away in anger.
This is just one more example of unloving and unacceptable action of a church board that has run off track.
Please act soon on this matter.
Sincerely,
Ann Blough
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From: victoryinhimhealed@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: re: forum online about spiritual abuse recovery
Date: December 21, 2006 9:11:20 PM MST
To: barrypendergast@shaw.ca
Hi Barry and Jennifer,
Thanks for considering adding my site as a resource.
I hate to have to agree with you that the overall
problem in the church seems to be getting worse all
around the world. After awhile, the stories seem
similar even if they originate in diverse
groups/denominations. There is another very good
site, I think it's from New Zealand called Attack of
the Super Apostles:
http://www.cultwatch.com/superapostles.html. I have a
links page on my site that has some
resources; some are Christian and some are secular.
Keep up the good work. I'm happy you've found an
OK church....it helps to have a positive focus as
you keep up this ministry. It is great to be finding
other Christian sites on the subject. The one that
helped me greatly when I started out years ago in
1999 was Lois Gibson's site on Spiritual Abuse.
Blessings in Christ,
Laurie
Group Email Addresses
Related Link:
http://www.geocities.com/victoryinhimhealed/Spiritual_abuse_recovery.html
Post message: spiritual-abuse-recovery@yahoogroups.com
Subscribe:
spiritual-abuse-recovery-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
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From: incognito34@VTmail.com
Subject: bleatinglambs web page
Date: January 2, 2007 9:07:06 PM MST
To: bleatinglambs@shaw.ca
somehow I stumbled upon your web page. my reaction was, as the earth has a circumference of approximately 24900 miles, is there not room on this planet where you can live and let live? Did you picket that church? did you SUE them? for crying out loud, this is pitiful. it appears that this whole web site is a complaint against that church. shame on you.
my advice is, get over it, and get a life. leave them alone! you're growing old in your bitterness. if there is abuse in a church, let the elders of the church handle it. if they can't or won't, move on. life is too short.
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somehow I stumbled upon your web page. my reaction was, as the earth has a circumference of approximately 24900 miles, is there not room on this planet where you can live and let live? Did you picket that church? did you SUE them? for crying out loud, this is pitiful. it appears that this whole web site is a complaint against that church. shame on you.
my advice is, get over it, and get a life. leave them alone! you're growing old in your bitterness. if there is abuse in a church, let the elders of the church handle it. if they can't or won't, move on. life is too short.
From: The Pendergasts
subject: Urgent Need For Reconciliation
Date: August 4th, 2006 5:39:38 PM MDT
To: bleatinglambs@shaw.ca
We can certainly identify with the issues raised in Carol Lawrence's email. We accept that the mot likely person to be abused in a church environment is the minister/pastor and his or her family. We attended the same church as Carol (it was our first church after our son died) and share the sadness at its breakup. Although we value many of the friendships made during that period we also appreciate the way it developed our discernment of right and wrong in church politics. It taught us a great deal about dealing with the differences that divide so many Christians. The inability of so many Christians to work through problems in a biblical manner is sadly lacking. Rather they resort to intrigue and treachery to force their viewpoint. There is virtually a total absence if using Matthew 18:15 to resolve differences - is it because most Christians are frightened to face a fellow Christian with a genuine concern?. Much of the reason for us starting the bleatinglambs web site is to open up an honest discussion on the topic.
What has saddened us more is the way many have hung onto a belief that the pastor and his wife were somehow totally responsible for the breakup. In our view, as we look back, we see people who claim to be self righteous yet for a variety of reasons conspired to bring the church down, To this day they take NO responsibility or ownership for the failure of the church to survive. This is still happening 12 years after the event! We certainly do take some responsibility but have dealt with any differences we had with the pastor and others directly - not behind their backs and not using the misuse of the forgiveness process as identified by Carol.
The pastor and his wife were totally there for us when our son died and both played a significant part in our both coming to Christ. Their compassion for others was so evident too. A number of times we have encouraged those that continue to place blame to examine their own hearts and then communicate in a loving way with the pastor directly. These are matters that must be dealt with in a Christlike manner and if necessary out in the open with mature and respected Christians helping. We are called as Christians to reconcile with our brothers and sisters in Christ - there is no other option. We live in hope that a reconciliation will take place between ourselves and South Calgary Community Church. Will not one person from that church step up to the plate?
Lastly what a waste to see one of the most talented evangelists in this city rendered impotent by so much misplaced blame and treachery of those he trusted as friends . We continue to pray the ministry the pastor and his wife started will not be over; that they will be healed from the years of hurt and that they will be surrounded by mature Christians who will not allow their envy to destroy a worthwhile ministry .
Barry & Jennifer
ps Oswald Chambers said, "God did not give us the spirit of discernment to criticize, but, to intercede."
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From: LHughes@stantec.com
Subject: WATCHTOWER LAWSUITS - LIMITED PARTNERSHIP
Date: July 28, 2006 5:39:38 PM MDT
To: bleatinglambs@shaw.ca
I am selling shares ( Units ) in two lawsuits. It is perfectly legal. The Wrongfull Death Claim is for approximately One Million Dollars. The Class Action Suit is for approximately One Billion Dollars. For one hundred dollars ( $100 ) you are a part Owner / Investor / Partner and take part in the action and you have the two opportunities of becoming a Millionaire. Your chances of winning are greater than winning a lottery. Also, you can experience the satisfaction of helping to put an end to Ban on Blood, being instrumental in saving the lives of thousands of Jehovah Witnesses and in striking a fatal blow to the Watchtower Society.
There are three ways in which you can earn alot of money:
Example Number One:
At present twenty ( 20 ) persons have donated $100 or more. Whoever has donated $100 now owns one unit. If the Defendants decided to now settle out of court, each unit would be worth $50,000. One person has donated $600, so that person could receive about $300,000.
Example Number Two:
The lawsuit goes to Trial. Because there is a team of lawyers willing to work Pro Bono, the legal expenses are low. Let us say as an estimate of $100,000 for expenses. We subtract $100,000 from $1,000,000, which would leave an Award of $900,000. If persons purchased 1000 Units then that would cover the $100,000 legal expenses. Each Unit would be worth about $900. The more Units you purchase, the more chances you have of winning. If most or all the Unit Owners agreed to there being only one winner, then one Unit Owner would win approximately $900,000.
Example Number Three:
Each Unit purchased would also be carried over to the Class Action Law Suit. The Class Action Law Suit, I hope to file in New York City in a few months from now, for a total of approximately One Billion Dollars. This is something I have been planning for four years. As a Unit Owner of the Wrongfull Death Suit, you automatically become a stakeholder in the Class Action Lawsuit at no extra cost. You could win alot of money as an investor in the lawsuit but also as a member of the Class, if you are an JW or xJW you could be awarded damages from the Judge. You do not have to be a former Jehovah Witness to purchase a Unit. Anyone can purchase a Unit and invest in these lawsuits. As an added note: If the Wrongfull Death Suit is won, there would be a very important precedent made that would be very beneficial in the Class Action Suit. That is one of the reasons that I started off with the Wrongfull Death Suit.
Attached is the legal description of the “ Limited Partnership for Lawsuit Funding against the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society”. I have been accused of suing the Watchtower for the money. For me it was never for the money. I want Justice for Bethany and to put a stop to the insanity of the Blood Ban. I do not want my other two daughters to die because of this religion. I do not want this to happen to any other family……..or children.
Lawrence Hughes
The name of the Trust Fund is “ SAVE THE CHILDREN ”.
The cheques should be made out to: “ SAVE THE CHILDREN ” and mailed to:
SAVE THE CHILDREN
C/O Lawrence Hughes
P.O Box 20161
Calgary Place, RPO
Calgary, Alberta, Canada, T2P 4J3
My email address is:
nyc_protest_rally@yahoo.ca
For those persons who wish to use PAYPAL, my account is: nyc_protest_rally@yahoo.ca
Many Thanks.
Lawrence Hughes
(see earlier email for details - also email Lawrence for full details of the offering)
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From: carolelawrence@shaw.ca
Subject: pastor abuse
Date: July 25, 2006 12:22:25 PM MDT
To: bleatinglambs.org
I wish to share an experience I had a number of years ago at a wonderful fellowship. I was not a Christian when I started attending this church,but was quickly drawn in by what I thought were loving,caring Christians. The pastor and his wife had started this church from nothing. And as they later described it was their "baby". It quickly grew because the pastor and his wife were true and passionate Christians.with exceptional gifts. He was a charismatic, talented speaker. He was humble, and had a way of drawing you in by his humour. He was always passionate when he spoke, and he always made his messages relevant and interesting,but mostly showed his commitment to God. He was able to explain the setting and culture of the times of Christ so well. He made his messages something you could take home and use in your everyday life. I remember one person describing Sunday as her "fix" for the week. When you spoke with him he really listened, and you would feel, as if you were the only one in the world. She was a exceptionally gifted person in so many ways as well; sang like an angel, very merciful. Again, when you talked with her, you were her total focus. Our church grew quickly , because he wanted to minister to pre- Christians ,and insisted on wonderful praise music for worship, having interesting relevant messages, and not a lot of talk about money. Because the church grew, he had a huge burden as so many who came, were not Christians and were very needy and as he was such a loving,caring individual he wanted to minister to everyone ,but simply couldn't do it by himself. I once described it way to his little daughter. When you want daddy's attention you get upset if he can't give it to you , you get very angry and may even say you "hate" him. Well this unfortunately is what happened. The congregation were mostly new Christians with many problems and he simply couldn't please all of them and a group turned on him. The attack was vicious in so many ways. The people were so immature that all they could think of were their needs, instead of seeing the big picture, which included that both the pastor and his wife had lost all four of their parents in quite traumatic ways in the previous year. Behind this attack were people who were part of the group who helped start the church,most being close personal friends so this made the betrayal even more devastating. Not to mention that there was huge damage to his reputation. Practically of course, it was his income. Well he ended up resigning ,because of the terrible affect this had on his wife and children. I will never forget that morning for me it was very upsetting and can remember fleeing to the bathroom shaking and crying. I'm not a crier so I think you can understand how this affected me. He left the ministry and the church lost one of the most gifted pastors I have ever known. Since then I've heard quite a few who have all been effective speakers, but none come even close. His wife was so affected emotionally that she was hospitalized and still is very withdrawn to this day. She simply can not trust herself to expose herself again ,because she knows if she was ever betrayed again she would not make it this time. I know that in their darkest moments they contemplated ending it all. The people who began this process have never to my knowledge repented, but have "GRACIOUSLY" OFFERED THEIR FORGIVENESS FOR ALL THE PAIN THEY SUFFERED! One of the most vivid of my memories was talking to him and him expressing his bewilderment had what had gone on. I will NEVER FORGET the pain in his eyes. They say the eyes are the window to the soul and I saw it that day! His eyes were always the most expressive part of him. The love of Jesus shone out of them. Now the pain of Jesus was expressed in his eyes. Why did God allow this to happen? I don't know. I think my pain continues because of the lack of repentance from the attackers. Satan was so afraid of this man's passion for the lost, he let loose with everything he had. I just know I was privileged to become a Christian at this church, and have him baptist me. He will always be my pastor. I was part of an Acts 11 church and was given a wonderful foundation and was part of a family of Christ, except for the people who were the attackers. This is the other side of the church abuse story. Pastors and their families are attacked more than we know.
carole lawrence
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From: LHughes@stantec.com
Subject: MESSAGE FROM LAWRENCE HUGHES
Date: July 19, 2006 9:32:39 AM MDT
To: barrypendergast@shaw.ca
Hi Barry ,
I have a court hearing at the Alberta Court of Appeals. I could use some assistance.
Would you please read the following message and post on the internet and forward to persons you know. Thanks.
Lawrence Hughes
Please post this message on other forums and send it to everyone you know asking them to forward it on to everyone they know. This is of the utmost importance. The lives of thousands of Jehovah Witnesses may depend on “ YOU ” doing this.
Recently, I have filed two Appeals at the Alberta Court of Appeals, which is the highest court in the Province. The only higher court in Canada is the Supreme Court. I have also filed a Notice of Motion at the Surrogate Court asking the court to appoint me the Executor of my dead daughters estate. A team of lawyers are assisting me at no charge because they believe that this is a very important lawsuit that needs to be heard.
Many professionals have said to me that if I win this lawsuit, it would benefit the Health Care Profession, the Legal Profession and it would set valuable precedents that could be used to make it a lot easier to sue the Watchtower Society and other Cults. Some of the best legal minds have also said that with the evidence that I have from my case and the evidence that “ YOU ” provided me over the years, that I can take down the Watchtower Society. What does that mean ? That means an end to the Ban on Blood. That means that your loved ones will not have to die as a Martyr for this Cult. That means that tens of thousands of lives will be saved. That means that the Corporation, the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society publishing company will be put out of business.
Wouldn’t you like to see that happen? Wouldn’t you like to know that your son or daughter would receive a blood transfusion when needed and not have to die as a Martyr for this Religion? Wouldn’t you like to see your family and friends set free from a life time of slavery to this Cult?
True……….I cannot do this alone. I need “ YOU ” to help! You have been very helpful in giving me the evidence I need to use in court. You have been very supportive emotionally. But now I need you to support me in another way. I have to pay the Court of Appeals $10,000 for Appeal Books. I have about $5,000 in the bank. I have a team of lawyers working free of charge because they believe I can win this lawsuit and that it is very important to win this lawsuit. If these lawyers believe whole heartedly in this and are willing to work very hard at this and not be payed, then shouldn’t you be willing to help as well?
Even if I were too loose. Think of the media coverage that would be generated from this lawsuit over the next few years. World News coverage on an ongoing basis for several years, exposing the Watchtower Society. I was interviewed on the National News each week for five (5) consequetive weeks last May and June. This story has been in the news on an average of once a month and in the National News on an average of every other month for the past four years. This lawsuit has been mentioned in the World News about five times since last September, covered by Associated Press on a number of occasions, CNN and Forbes Magazine. What is that kind of media coverage worth ???? I have been contacted by hundreds of persons who have left the Watchtower Society because of this media coverage. Persons from all over the world have been following this story.
Please help to put an end to the senseless killing of “ YOUR ” family and friends. Please help put and end to the unbelievable damage that the Watchtower Society is doing to families each day. The next paragraph is about what happened , followed by information on how you can help. It is of utmost importance that you forward this message to everyone you know asking them to forward it as well. Thank you.
Lawrence Hughes
My daughter’s health had improved considerably. The Watchtower Society was concerned that Child Welfare would apply for an Apprehension and Treatment Order and force Bethany to receive blood transfusions. As a result of that, the Watchtower Society convinced my sixteen year old daughter and her mother that Arsenic would cure her desease. Then they arranged to take my daughter and family into hiding. The Watchtower then arranged for a doctor to prescribe Arsenic. The Defendants then fed Bethany the Arsenic. The top three Specialists in the World will testify in court that Arsenic is not treatment fot the desease Bethany had and that the Arsenic killed her and that with conventional treatment, Bethany would have had a 50% chance of surviving her desease.
Bethany had told me that her lawyer, David Gnam from the WTS HQ, promised her that her story would be featured in the "Awake" magazine, if she died refusing a blood transfusion. David Gnam, in violation of a Court Order, took a video of my sick daughter, and circulated the video all across North America to the Watchtower Society Branch Offices and Kingdom Halls. They made my daughter into a Poster Child……..into a Martyr for the Religion. Will you help me to put a stop to this insanity? Will you help me put an end to the Blood Policy? Will you help me pressure the WTS to change its policy and allow Jehovah Witnesses to have blood transfusions? My daughter, Bethany might be alive today if it wasn’t for this blood policy. I have two other daughters in this religion and I do not want them to die because of this religion. I am sure you, too, are very concerned about your family and loved ones who are Jehovah Witnesses. Do not give up hope. As long as there is life, there is hope. Do something “ NOW ” before it is too late ! Two persons from my workplace, an Accountant and a Commisionaire of Oaths have set up a TRUST FUND to cover the legal expenses. I do not have access to this account. Both their signatures are required to make out cheques to cover legal expenses. The donations will be returned to you if I win the lawsuit or if the donations are not needed. Your anonymity will be protected and I will be the only person keeping a record of who donates.
The name of the Trust Fund is “ SAVE THE CHILDREN ”.
The cheques should be made out to: “ SAVE THE CHILDREN ” and mailed to:
• SAVE THE CHILDREN
C/O Lawrence Hughes
P.O Box 20161
Calgary Place, RPO
Calgary, Alberta, Canada, T2P 4J3
My email address is:
nyc_protest_rally@yahoo.ca
For those persons who wish to use PAYPAL, my account is: nyc_protest_rally@yahoo.ca
Many Thanks.
Lawrence Hughes
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From: thebunchabunches@sbcglobal.net
Subject: Thank You!!!!
Date: July 12, 2006 4:47:35 PM MDT
To: bleatinglambs@shaw.ca
To Whom It May Concern,
Thank You...Thank You...for standing your ground. A friend and I also have stories of leadership abuse. I will not go into that right now. I really wish I had found this site about 2 years ago. And with my friend's story...one, she not only shares my story because we went to the same church but... my friend also went to another church and unfortunatly got "beaten" again but this time it was alot worse. I personally do not believe in the institution of the church anymore after what happened to me. I also no longer call myself a "christian" I like to refer to myself as a child of God. I am not only writting to tell you thank you but to also let you know that I am writting this because my friend tried to write you for some suggestions but her e-mail that she wrote you was undeliverable. I know she is needing some guidance that I am not able to give. If you could write her and let her know that there is help I would greatly appriciate it. .
Your sister in Christ-
Molly-
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From: admin@bullyinginstitute.org
Subject: Bullying on TV now & future
Date: July 5, 2006 6:58:07 PM MDT
To: admin@bullybusters.org
Dear BullyBuster:
A. Major TV coverage of bullying
The long-delayed Dateline NBC show on bad bosses and bullying will air on Friday July 7, check listings for local time. Our near certainty is based on their airing promos for the show. Canadian friends on this list, look for the American NBC network.
This is a show to watch/tivo/tape for future reference and to share with lawmakers when and if you become a citizen lobbyist for the anti-bullying Healthy Workplace Bill. From this exposure will certainly come other opportunities to move the cause closer to the light, piercing the shroud of shame and secrecy which bullies require to be sustained. And all of you play a role. Don't stay silent!
Those of you who signed up to go "On Record" with the media in the future could land your stories on shows such as this. Joe D. whose trial is featured on the show began as a bullied target just like you, read our book, The Bully At Work, and found us. His humanity shines through in the interview. His lesson is that justice can prevail if you remain focused.
B. Another CURRENT national TV opportunity.
Turn in a bully! Dr. Phil is currently soliciting people for a show on bullying. It is not a call specifically for workplace tales, but if you all BOMBARD the producers, they will get the message that Workplace Bullying deserves its own focus, separate from school bullying.
It's time for everyone on this WBTI list to complete the show's form.
http://www.drphil.com/plugger/respond/?plugID=10306
As you tell your tale, also mention
1. Workplace Bullying is important enough to devote an entire show to it, and
2. WBTI is coordinating the national movement to get states to pass the Healthy Workplace Bill.
Enjoy Dateline and participate in the Dr. Phil call for stories. Deluge his producers with thousands of names. Tell everyone you know to help "turn in a bully."
Dr. Gary Namie
Workplace Bullying & Trauma Institute (WBTI)
http://bullyinginstitute.org
http://bullybusters.org
Work Doctor, Inc.
http://workdoctor.com
--
From: patinohio@aol.com
Subject: Re: Church abuse
Date: May 30, 2006 1:43:55 PM MDT
To: bleatinglambs.org
Hi,
Came across your website.
We, too were thrown out of church, 1990 and to this day remained shunned. Tried another church after about 6 years. Unbeknownst to us,they were in communication with the leaders of our old church and just waiting to jump on us. They also threw us out.
The first case was for daring to question some strange practices that were going on and then we found out some very serious sexual problems with the pastor and his foster daughter. He did away with us very slick and severe. I once had cancer and this was worse than going through cancer.
The second time around was just a reprint of the first time, because the old church severely damaged our reputation. It was just a matter of time before they manufactured a reason to get rid of us. But when it finally happened, I was devastated all over again.
I have never gotten over it. Nothing was ever resolved We very loosely go to another church, but are barely involved, and to tell you the truth, I just wish we didn't have to go at all.
Our story happened in the 90's,before the advent of the internet, so therefore, we had no support or outlet, and really still don't to this day. At least, however, we have discovered we are not alone. We used to be so isolated with our weird "cult" story. No one to talk to about it. Even "normal" churches don't want to touch this with a ten-foot pole. They just want us to join all the programs and get on with it.
With all of the scandals that have happened in the church (as a whole) in the last decade, you would think this stuff would start to be resolved, but not at all. In fact, I was dismayed to see how recent your situation occurred. It all makes me very sad and with little hope that we will ever find a fellowship of any kind to belong to before we die. (It is amazing that I even still long for it).Thanks for telling your story and listening to mine ( the abbreviated version, the full version is hideous). If you know anyone in our area, I would love to actually talk to someone about this.
I don't mind if you use my note,
Thanks,
Pat'nohio
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From: cthruyou@hotmail.com
Subject: reply to Scott Debrecen
Date: May 28, 2006 7:30:43 PM MDT
To: bleatinglambs@shaw.ca
You asked whether I have experienced abusive church leadership? YOU BET!! Infact, in all the years of being drug up thru church, there isn't much I haven't seen or experienced. From the splits too numerous to mention, to dodging the local in-residence church pervert as a kid, sexual scandals involving leadership, to manipulating (and downright evil) pastor's wives, to wanna-be, power hungry pastors themselves....honestly...my story would probably not be believed.
In the natural, there is no reason for me to be a Christian based on what I've seen and experienced from so called "believers". Most of my cousins are back slidden for this very reason. It was a farce!
AS for me, yes I've been targeted myself. In fact, here in my city, there is a pastor/wife duo with very similar tactics to the gruesome twosome you tangled with. They zero'ed in and went for the jugular after the wife became threatened by me (I was the music leader and she has a low self esteem...a dust particle is a threat to a chick like that). Then my music started receiving more compliments than the sermons...done deal. The same satanic script that you shared was enacted on me and my husband. We didn't fight it out so long, we hightailed it out of there but not without some serious scars.
Barry, that's really what it is. The devil is not a creative being, he does the same old junk over and over. And lucky for him...it works like a charm!
So you see, the script he gives to compromised, self-serving "Christians" varies very little from church to chrurch or denomination. The devil holds an audition, casts the roles, goes into rehearsals....and voila! Here is yet another performance of abusive, corrupt leadership stumbling, crushing and persecuting the flock.
And true to form, the ones who choose to be used of the devil in this manner care very little about the bible's ominous warnings to those who "stumble the little ones" or "scatter the flock". In their fallen minds its all justified, rationalised and excused. Infact, I've come to the conclusion that folks like this...all church stuff and ministry aside...are not well. Some have personality disorders, others could not EVER be successful and influential in the real world so decided their ticket to power and reputation was to jump around hollering 'Jesus'! Some are narcissists, some I firmly believe to be sociopaths.
Well, whatever their diagnosis is...one thing's for sure. There is a spirit behind all of these folks and their mess. And guess what it is? That old witch, that ancient evil...the Jezebel spirit. It operates in men and women and once it's come after you, you never want to tangle with that thing again! At least I don't. And trust me, it's taken a run at me more times than I'd care to mention.
Now I don't go seeing a devil under every bush like some folks. I'm very realistic. But the things I've survived in church and at the hands of "christians" would make you're hair curl and the Lord has brought me to the knowlege of this spirit and its methods.
Sounds like you and your wife have been just more unfortunate victims of the aforementioned satanic script. Welcome to the battered sheep club! The good news is that battered sheep can rise up and become powerful rams...yup...that ram in the bush. In fact, God has used me in that very way in some rather large public settings. It all works for the good as those with the kind of knowlege and experience like we have are often assigned special missions in God's army: those which require discernment, special knowlege and courage.
And bringing all this stuff to light was the right thing to do, despite pastor Scott's attempt to stuff it all back in the closet. If he wants to spend his days doing that sort of thing and upholding corrupt religious systems...its only because he's getting something out of it all. If it all comes tumbling down, guys like him are going down with it and they instictively know that. It scares the beejeebers out of them. But again, propping up a toxic religous system is his choice....and his consequence.
Barrry, keep shining the light on what is done in darkness!
Blessings,
Mrs C.Thoughyou
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From: bleatinglambs.org
Subject: reply to Scott Debrecen
Date: May 17, 2006 7:30:43 PM MDT
To:cthruyou@hotmail.com
Mrs. C. Thruyou
We appreciate your respone to Pastor Scott's email with which we obviously agree. We are naturally curious whether you have had any personal experiences with abuse in the church?
A Bleating Lamb
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From: cthruyou@hotmail.com
Subject: reply to Scott Debrecen
Date: May 16, 2006 7:30:43 PM MDT
To: bleatinglambs@shaw.ca
Pastor Scott,
Your commentary, while eloquent and complete with Biblical references, is
what I have come to term the "SHHH!" response.
Luckily, I speak and can translate Christianese! So your underlying message
to sweep mess under the rug, look the other way, & keep things quiet leads
me to ask one thing:
"What do YOU have to hide?"
Mrs. C. Thruyou
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From: sbumgard@gmail.com
Subject: Your Website.
Date: May 9, 2006 10:28:24 AM MDT
To: bleatinglambs@shaw.ca
Although I do sympathize with your plight, I believe that you could have dealt with it better.
If you have disagreements with the pastor and elders of a local church, and you see that the differences are irreconcilable, leave. Go to church elsewhere. Start over.
I have found myself in similar circumstances. I left. I returned ten years later to find a new church with a different pastor. I am now the Youth Pastor and Adult Sunday School teacher. The new pastor and I are very close. We work well together.
Life is too short to spend it in bitterness. Move on...and up!!
Scottie
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from: (name witheld by request)
Subject: trying to forgive
Date: March 20, 2006 11:35:52 AM MST
To: bleatinglambs@shaw.ca
To those who care,
I have been struggling with this issue for a number of years. My children were abused in a charismatic church. Because we were never very involved there, we experienced the abuse secondhand. To watch your child suffering is not easy. To see their whole life unravel is pure torment. Young people naievly place leaders on a pedestal and believe their formulas for spiritual succes. They put their trust in people who abandon them when their lives unravel.
These same leaders insist that they are the ones who have the wisdom to guide them and to counsel them, and 'speak into their lives'. Only God has that authority.
Because these leaders allow no one to confront them about their actions, they continue their abusive behavior. I wish they could understand the damage they do to vulnerable people.
I struggle to forgive. I want to forgive, but these are people who could have showed love and caring; who could have been kind. They were our spiritual leaders. They abandoned us. They cared only to maintain power and control (to remind us of our responsibilities). In the Bible Jesus says the one who abandons his sheep is not a shepherd but only a hireling who cares nothing for the sheep.
Yet I refuse to live in bitterness. I will forgive; although I have not overcome yet. When I see certain people on the street my heart is full of anger, and I have great difficulty. But I pray to the one who loves me and who loves those who abuse. He will help me.
I will forgive, but I will always have difficulty trusting anyone in leadership (my children also). My trust in Jesus Christ continues to grow, however. I will look to God who said in Ezekiel that He would seek for the sheep wandering all over the hills after the shepherds abandoned them.
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From: (name witheld by request)
Subject: another one speaking out
Date: March 6, 2006 2:37:47 PM MST (CA)
To: bleatinglambs@shaw.ca
We have worked hard for years to regain peace and quiet, leaving that city, keeping our phone number unlisted for years, and don’t want to re open ourselves to the abuse BUT
It does happen, it’s very real, and any denomination can do this to it’s members. All it takes is a controlling person at the top, and a compliant group of followers, and another abusive church is born.
I think a lot of the shepherding doctrines and teachings have made it worse, as have much of the newer charismatic stuff coming out of the Toronto Airport Vineyard group and the followers of C Peter Wagners new apostolic stuff, but the root lies in power.
Power is corruptive and it’s difficult to be in leadership and not be tempted by it, particularly if a person has a controlling nature. (which is why if they follow a strong pyramid style of leadership and connection to other city churches that are “mutually accountable” such as Peter Wagner advocates, I’d avoid that church if I were you!)
That is what happened to us. It happened in north central BC in a medium size city. We don’t live there anymore.
My husband, myself, and our kids were excommunicated when we told everyone we could what we found out our church had done to ex members, what they were doing at that time to a pastor under the head pastor and how they had threatened and taken a business from some members, some weird theology that they were getting into, etc.
We left. We told as many as we could including the denominational covering what was going on. Predictably that denomination didn’t listen.
After all my ex pastor used to be the moderator, and at that time he still held power over ministry qualifications so there was ALSO the implied threat that any minister in that denomination could LOSE his qualifications if he threatened this man. This man had control of the whole situation.
It was after the letters went out that we heard from friends still in that church that the pastor read our names from the pulpit and told the congregation to have nothing to do with us, and that we were no longer welcome in that church. That is the excommunication I refer to. That pastor was too savvy to give us a document in writing stating that we were formally excommunicated but I wish he had.
That church, a charismatic one, -- had many ex members who all said the same thing when they contacted us (we didn’t talk to ALL the ex members but it was stunning how many took time to look us up when they heard).
They would go to the head pastor and bring concerns. If he couldn’t talk them out of their worries, then the next step was to announce that he and the board and elders were “dealing” with this person and would appreciate it if the rest of us would leave them alone while they worked out the concerns, so as not to spread the gossip and anger that these poor deluded folk were struggling with.
Which meant that nobody could get their concerns dealt with publically. Meanwhile their character was assassinated publically and all without the SLIGHTEST opportunity to respond and rebut. One man I spoke with returned for many meetings, till finally his exhausted wife demanded that it stop. As long as they were talking though, the pastor didn’t get nasty. But when the talks were over, the message from the pulpit was to avoid them, not listen to them. They were carefully prevented from giving their side to the church. As requested during the series of meetings, he and his wife dutifully didn’t mention it to anyone else. Afterwards they were too exhausted and terrorized.
I feel angry that this goes on, but the story is the same again and again.
Matthew 18 is used to justify this abuse and silence the accusations and the accusers. We made our concerns public in a mass mail out, but it was still ignored. We hadn’t gone to the pastor first!
We couldn’t.
Not if we wanted to be heard.
Many had gone to our ex pastor in the past with the same concerns, and were shut down before they could contaminate the rest of the church with the truth. We knew that it would be the same as all the others. Psychological wearing down till giving up in exhaustion and fear of reprisal. We would become the silent ones who left without the energy to continue their battle.
AS a strategy to prevent criticism it worked like a charm.
We got 2 rounds of letters out, but realized quickly that few within were listening. We were roundly criticized and abused. I remember one beautiful screaming fit that the head of the music ministry (a woman, wife of a missionary) threw on my behalf in the local Christian bookstore in front of all and sundry. I stopped going there too.
However our letters were photocopied and passed around the huge numbers of ex members that this particular church had damaged. We heard from so many more and realized it had been going on a long long long time. By the time we left we realized this church had damaged lots of other people in the community over the past 18 years that we could track and possibly further.
Many within that church refused to read our letters including elders (who told people who told us), because we hadn’t gone to the pastor first. We didn’t because there was no point. It was WAY beyond a simple dispute.
One last example of many. I referred to a business.
That business that they stole or forcibly took however you wish to phrase it, was a dance business. I say stole because the business was in lieu of wages.
Either that couple were owed back wages OR they were owed the price of a business. They got neither. Which means that either way you slice it, they were out a lot of money due to the actions of this church. Hence my term STOLE!!!!
Here is how it happened.
I was there the day that the dance teacher told the ladies bible study that because the church couldn’t afford to pay them any longer, they would own the dance academy business outright. This was so that they could continue to fund the dance ministry themselves out of the dance school, under the “covering” of that church.
But from now on, the business and it’s profits belonged to them in lieu of wages and benefits. It was struggling, and they lived on less than the skimpy wage the church paid them when they came from New Zealand to start it up. But they accepted that and the business and all its’ problems and potential was theirs. That was a few years after they’d arrived.
Fair enough since when they came they’d sunk all their time and energy into it. They had gone broke on the wages that church paid. When they came from NZ they were promised a salary for both, and what they got instead was a salary, paid to one, and not quite enough to live on. But not knowing the cost of living here, or the usual salaries, they had agreed to a bargain basement salary. On top of that the man was expected to also volunteer as a janitor. They put up with that and used up their own funds that they came with, sinking good money after bad feeling that God had let them here.
But some years later --after accepting this business in lieu of wages,-- they left. It was when they objected along with us to the treatment that one of the underpastors was getting, and the shift to dominionist theology, with an anti-Semitic sermon that finished us all off.
When word got back to “leadership”, they were threatened that if they didn’t comply and stay within the church they would lose the business. If they took it out from the “covering” that the church would ban members from putting their kids in for dance classes. Watch out for any church that trumpets a lot about the covering concept. It’s a nasty way that churches have to keep an eye on you and although it’s supposed to mean they are accountable, in actual fact, they aren’t. At least in my experience and the experience of others that I’ve read of who go thru this.
Since the dance school wasn’t that popular outside the church (this church has a bad rep that is well earned) and many people wouldn’t put their daughters in a school associated with that church this meant that this couple would have a business but not enough students to survive.
They were too broke to continue the fight.
To add insult to injury the church demanded the costumes, the plywood floors, anything of any value that “belonged” to the business. The academy itself was behind church locked doors in a church owned building so even though all this stuff belonged to a business these people technically owned, and even though most of these objects had been bought or sewn by the couple (I can attest to this in particular, as my son was involved in building the floors and went with the man to purchase the plywood) OUT OF THEIR OWN DWINDLING SAVINGS
Even though all this was true, the church took possession of it all (possession is 9/10ths of the law????) including the business license stuck on the wall which they scratched out and used behind the book stall in the church lobby (I checked, and saw, this occurred although it was taken down shortly after perhaps from good legal advice to avoid trouble)
Not that my friends could afford a lawyer. They asked around, but it was summer and nobody wanted to take them on against this church. They sent complaints to the denomination but those went unheard. The lawyers in that city don’t do a whole lot of pro bono work.
That pastor even came to see them, and asked them on the way out of their house if their CD player was “theirs” or was it the Dance Academys’. It was THEIRS but that greedy little man was after the little they had left.
He lived in a lovely big new home, with expensive furniture, in a nice section of town. They lived in the poor section of town, in a rental unit, with broken down second hand furniture given them when they arrived. (most under pastors under him lived in near poverty while he enjoyed wealth by comparison) Of course when you preach tithing and praise and reward big tithers in the church, money is available for the servant of God and often he isn’t inclined to share with fellow pastors.
Back to the dance teacher couple. They had just enough credit on one of their maxed out cards to afford a moving truck to take them to a friend down in Vancouver BC. They tried to get jobs but the stress was taking it’s toll and the husband ended up in the psch ward. Not surprising. They ended up a year or two later going back to New Zealand, broke, exhausted, in shattered health, mentally, physically and financially.
That church still lists that dance school on it’s website. I guess possession really is 9/10ths of the law.
God is watching. I don’t place any trust in the legal system to deal with them, but God is watching. They changed their name a year after we left that city, and they lost more members since. The pastor went to another city for a time, but came back home to take control over his church again. God is watching. They remain in that city, with members who continue to be deceived but God is watching.
God is merciful in that He doesn’t strike us dead when we sin. But over time, we are given opportunity to repent, over time if we continue to refuse to repent, God has a way of speaking louder and LOUDER in His Grace. He is not willing that we remain in our sins, He hates our controlling behaviour, our willingness to step into HIS place in people’s lives and hearts but He is gracious to give time to repent.
If any church member reading this letter, from any church accused of abuse is listening please don’t be like me, and brush the concerns aside. Truthful open churches are open and transparent in their dealings. Over time, you will see who is telling the truth.
Meanwhile God’s mercy is extended. REPENT QUICKLY while you have the chance. There will come a time, and it is coming when abusive churches will be known for what they are, with no place to hide, nowhere to go, nobody else to blame. The truth will come out, and it cannot be stopped.
I am glad to see this website, and others like it who are ministering to those whose wounds are so severe that they may never be able to go into a church again. I am one of the ones who did finally make it back but it’s been a long slow process. I finally started going to a safe church almost 2 years after the excommunication and those years were hard. When we sang songs that the old church used to sing over and over (till we “entered in” to worship properly which is an abusive thing too) I would dash outside and hang over the railing trying not to throw up.
I now teach courses in Boundaries at our church, and it’s amazing the number of new members who take that course who are escaping abuse from all denominations, and finding freedom. I teach a ladies bible study where not too surprisingly I focus on the Bible instead of a lot of topical books loaded with strange new teachings. The bible is safe. I also major in Grace, as a teaching, which is so wonderfully explained in Romans and Galatians.
May I highly recommend the books by Jeff Vanvonderan and Enroth and Blue that are mentioned here. They were the first step to healing for our family. Also the book Boundaries by Dr’s Cloud and Townsend, 2 gifted Christian psychologists. They also wrote 12 “Christian” Beliefs that can drive You Crazy. That book was wonderful too, as it pinpointed many of these beliefs that we think are Christian but aren’t and they are the very teachings that set us up for abuse and control.
May I also recommend some reading on the various discernment web sites that explain why and how these pastors get their doctrine to justify this disgusting behaviour. After all they really didn’t wake up asking Satan what they could do to destroy Christians today, they got hung up by believing some crappy lie the enemy fed to the church as “doctrine” which I think is what the Bible might call the doctrine of demons. THAT AND due to their own love of power which helped them swallow that foul doctrine of control, and a lack of true accountability --they got caught up in a cycle of sin and ever increasing abusive behaviour. Still doesn’t justify one bit, the behaviour, the abuse, the wickedness that they commit, but it may help to see where it comes from.
We found Sandy Simpson’s DITC site really helpful, especially his 5 basic doctrines. I also found Jewel Van der merwe’s site helpful with that book Strange Fire on site. There are others of note but a good one with many short articles is the CAIC one where I first really realized what church abuse was, and how my ex church fit as an abusive cult.
CAIC’s main page is here http://www.caic.org.au/zentry1.htm and they have a separate one for church abuse here http://www.caic.org.au/zabusive.htm
And I’ve got Sandy here http://www.deceptioninthechurch.com/
And Jewel is here bless her, she is a real jewel to the church http://discernment-ministries.org/
And there are more that are wonderful that they link to, but here is a warm hug, and a blessing on all those who struggle with the abuse itself, and the continuing ongoing denial of that abuse by the church communities that turned a blind eye.
Jesus knows, He sees your heart, and He loves you and in time I pray that you will see this as a turning point in your life, when you began to realize that some people and some churches are desperately deceived and although they did the work of the enemy in harming you
You are free now. Free to think for yourself, free to examine the bible for yourself, free to love and be loved and have a life that glorifies God without some man’s control or woman’s control inserting itself where only God belongs.
God bless you and I hope you find safe havens, rest and healing as I have.
Love in Christ
Another one.
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From: (name witheld by request)
Subject: RE: need i say more
Date: March 5, 2006 8:47:28 PM MST (CA)
To: barrypendergast@shaw.ca
Dear Barry,
Thanks for your willingness to share you story, and your shockingly FAST reply. It is always a blessing to find other people who have gone through the severe spiritual abuse that we have encountered. I do not know those Australians you spoke of, unfortunately im sure there is a lot of spiritually abusive churches here as there are all over the world. Im sure you find it where you go, but here, when you talk about it, and share some of the terribly shocking stories that happened, people in Christian circles get so uneasy, they think firstly you landed from Mars the day before, and secondly I have found that so many ‘christians’ get really defensive and the comments such as “oh are you sure you should really fight them” and “oh im not so sure that protesting is the christian thing to do” and the worst one “maybe the best thing to do is pray”. I mean these people have no idea the damage that abusive churches have on people.
One of my friends committed suicide after leaving the church we were in. He claimed to have been sexually assaulted by the pastor and now that he is dead, there is nothing we can do about it. It is such a painful situation.
I am happy for you to put my message on your website. I think it would be beneficial if you put a copy of the article in the good weekend and the transcript from the tv report “unholy devotion” up also as they really tell the story well.
Currently we are fighting a $7M defamation case which was launched by the church after some of us appeared on the TV report mentioned above. Like all other people, we simply told the truth and the church elders, well lets say, they got upset, but that’s a little of an understatement. There is also countless millions of dollars tied up in property and wage disputes. One teacher worked in their school for 25 years, and is owed around $3M alone. The church pays its teachers about 10% of what they should be being paid and also convinced members to sell their homes and give the money to the church. The church has net assets of about $45M but pays its staff about $13000 AUD a year. It’s a pretty disgusting situation, and a huge stain on the face of Christianity, the Baptist churches of the nation and also the Christian Schooling movement here in AUS.
With my prayers,
(name witheld by request).
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From:(name witheld by request)
Subject: need i say more
Date: March 5, 2006 7:33:18 PM MST (CA)
To: bleatinglambs@shaw.caDear Bleating lambs,
I have been reading your stories on the website, and all I can say is, I know how you feel. It is exactly the same as my situation and that of hundreds of others who have been abused at the hands of the elders of Sydney based independant baptist community, AUSTRALIA. I don’t really know what to say, but I could have written all those stories, and they would have been exactly the same. Also do a search on “the good weekend magazine” for a story entitled “his brothers keeper”. I think you will ‘enjoy’ reading them.
Praise God for our freedom and the work you are doing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Abuse in Christian churches is the most terrible thing I can ever imagine going through, and until you’ve been there, you have NO IDEA!!!!!
Much love and prayers for you and your work,
(name witheld by request)
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From: scottddeb@shaw.ca
Subject: RE: Pendergast crusade
Date: February 10, 2006 11:52:39 AM MST (CA)
To: barrypendergast@shaw.ca
Reply-To: office@rejoicechurch.ca
Hi. Thanks for responding. See notes in blue.
-----Original Message-----
From: Barry Pendergast [mailto:barrypendergast@shaw.ca]
Sent: Friday, February 10, 2006 11:04 AM
To: office@rejoicechurch.ca
Subject: Re: Pendergast crusade
Scott
Appreciate you taking the time to respond. Happy to meet and discuss this sometime. Yes, I would like that. Naturally we take an opposite view - when the results of abuse at SCCC resulted in three women ending up in hospital - two in mental wards, one man contemplated suicide and many more secretly abused and have never returned to a church. If thats the kind of church you support , and let carry on I guess we are a long way apart. I am with you and on the same team when it comes to raising up healthy churches. As I said in the original email I don't know either party, I don't know the details but I do know that a church divided is a conquered church. That is my message. I believe in the church. I love the church. I know that it is imperfect. I know that we have issues. I know that whenever humans get involved there is always room for error but I believe in the he church and I guess I am saddened by this whole thing. I stand by my thoughts that I wonder what unbelievers would make of this. What Christ Himself makes of this. What Would Jesus Do? Well, the Word lets us know. I just can't justify the crusade, I'm sorry. We naturally tend to side with respected Christian authors like Ronald Enroth, Marc Dupont, Ken Blue and Cara Beed who equate spiritual and emotional abuse to sexual abuse. The pain and long term effects are the same. I agree. I just am perplexed as to the extent of this crusade. Hey, maybe I am naive. Maybe, I'm an idealist. I just can't seem to shake what I see in the scripture of what we should do when wrongs happen to us. Harbouring bitterness and prolonging the hurt through launching a crusade does nothing to heal the wounds. Working through it with the help of counsellors, giving it completely over to Jesus and trusting God to vindicate is the what I see. Again, this is how I see scripture and this is what I personally have had to do over the years. I have been a Senior Pastor for 8 years (in my second church plant here in Calgary). I have worked as an Associate Pastor for 7 years and friend I have stories to tell of abuse that I have taken or that I have seen first hand that other Pastors have taken from congregational members. Abuse that has been unfounded and unwarranted. Pastors drop off the scene by droves over abuse they take from members. In fact, this is the #1 reason why Pastors quit or have nervous breakdowns. Should we not form a union and have a crusade vilifying congregational members? Again, I am not sticking up for the church in question. I don't know them (I've only been in Calgary for 6 mths and we are only 11 weeks into the church plant) with situations like this wrong is always present on both sides. But...I am sticking up for what I see in scripture. This is why I write, this is why am saddened, this is why I cannot support this crusade. Does the church need help? Yes. Does the church resolve every issue properly? No. Do our (Pastors and Leaders) eyes need to be opened to effective conflict resolutions. Yes. But do we go about this way, the way the Pendergasts are going about it? In my opinion no. Educate... Yes. Inform... Yes. But don't vilify the church. Don't mention names. Don't point fingers. There are wise ways to go about it. In my opinion more effective ways to go about it. Do I think repentance needs to occur? Yes on both sides. But true repentance that stops name calling and finger pointing. If I was your Pastor or the Pendergasts Pastor, I would counsel them and you to take the road that Joseph travelled with his brothers. In the end, look at the blessings that followed. I also would counsel for you to deal with this from a third party perspective. Not to name names nor from an attack position but more from on a informational position. Again, I want my church to be aware of and to be able to identify a healthy leader, so that when a non-healthy leader shows up they can spot them a mile away. If this is your position then I stand with you but...not in the manner in which I currently see. We also take strength from Matthew 23 when Jesus had no problems publicly attacking the moral character of the Pharisees. Yes, but Pharisees were not followers of Christ, we are and we do have a standard set by Jesus and confirmed through the patriarchs on how to live our lives in respect toward one another. Should He have turned His cheek instead?
Would you like your email added to the web site? Sure. I don't mind.
Barry
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From: scottddeb@shaw.ca
Subject: Pendergast crusade
Date: February 10, 2006 10:27:24 AM MST (CA)
To: bleatinglambs@shaw.ca
Reply-To: office@rejoicechurch.ca
I must say, the way you carry on with regards to the Pendergasts story is well...quite shocking in light of your motto: Devoted to making all churches healthy, thriving and safe. Allow me to explain. First, in reading the accounts I am left with the impression that the church was vilified and the Pendergasts justified. To me and this is just me, I see the Pendergasts as having an overwhelming sense of bitterness from their experience and that they are out to right the wrong done to them. The church community of South Calgary has been almost demonized. Sure the Pendergasts may have been hurt and yes, the leadership of the church may not have handled the situation correctly but where in the scripture do we see what the Pendergasts have done and our doing via their webpage and their crusade as being right. No where! You can't find it! In fact, what we do see and what we are commanded to do is to love, is to forgive, is turn the other cheek, is to never bring your brother to court (if something illegal has been done than that is different but in this case it was church discipline)...these are themes written throughout the scripture and one that Christ exemplified for us. Did David attack Saul after all the evil that Saul did to him? Did Stephen hold grudges? Did Joseph harbour bitterness and go on a crusade and publish slander against his brothers? I'm sorry but I am extremely disappointed with the whole press this thing is getting and the monster it has become.
Secondly, church discipline is never an easy thing but sometimes it is necessary. Paul says, "a little leaven, leavens the lump". I don't know the Pendergasts, nor do I know the church but I do know that the bible says, "you will know them by their fruit" and "Out of the same mouth come praise and cursing. My brothers this should not be so." To curse someone is to pronounce judgement upon; to attack character or to condemn and damn. Is this scriptural? Is this the legacy we want to leave with the upcoming generation? Again, I don't know the full details but I think the Pendergasts have shown their true colors. Their tree is bearing fruit, fruit that I would never want to eat. Their fruit is toxic and dangerous and extremely harmful to the Christian environment in Calgary. I can say this by simply following the example set before us in scripture with Jesus leading the way, followed by how David handled the Saul situation and how Joseph handled his bro's. Come on! When evil is done to you - which the Pendergasts say happened, what are we to do...go on a crusade in the name of...righting a wrong and protecting others...come on! How old are we! Is this the future of the church? Too me, this issue is extremely toxic and should be dropped - rather MUST be dropped immediately.
Yes. The church community here in Calgary is not perfect, in fact, no church community is but what we don't need is for someone or some group to go on a public rampage vilifying the church. "The world will know that we are Christians by our love" gees I wonder what my unbelieving neighbours would think about this issue and the ensuing battle or monster that has been formed? What would they think of this website or the Pendergasts website or crusade? I would venture it would be right along the line of what the devil has been feeding them for years. That the church is a loser and that they are no different then they are, in fact, probably worse. No one! I repeat no one benefits. Yes, there maybe short-term victory but the battle will be lost cause we are focusing our energies on fighting each other rather the real enemy. In closing all I can say is "Oh Father, please forgive us, we know not what we do."
Pastor Scott Debrecen
Rejoice Church
148 Citadel Cl NW (Office)
Calgary, Ab
T3G 4A6
403-313-2349
office@rejoicechurch.ca
www.rejoicechurch.ca
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From: bleatinglambs.org
Date: January 17, 2006
To: faith lost in Scarborough
Dear friends,
So appreciate your letter and concern. We were fortunate to be surrounded by a small group of faithful and caring Christians outside of South Calgary Community Church who would not let us sink too far. They have led us to another church and a caring and loving environment in which we can grow and contribute again. Never the less its responses like yours that compel us to keep this web site up and running. We will continue to work with those around the globe who know that abusive churches are turning people like you away from their faith. We cannot sit idly by and watch that happen. As we progress we have realised that those who deliberately hurt and abused us, and those that enabled it to happen are very sick people spiritually. We pray for their recovery and realization of what they have done.
Again thanks for writing and we will pray that you will recover the faith you once had.
Barry
From: faith lost in Scarborough
Subject: Your website
Date: January 17, 2006 3:50:16 PM MST (CA)
To: bleatinglambs@shaw.ca
Dear Pendergast family:
Just thought I would say that I came across your website today and I think you are doing a huge public service by discussing the issue of spiritual abuse. I was saddened to hear of your horrendous treatment at the hands of your church in Calgary. I look forward to reading the Christian Week piece as well.
I pray that you find a way to somehow deal with your legal fees. In my case, I chose not to get lawyers involved - in my opinion, these people are not worth a dime.
It is very unfortunate to say this about evangelicals but when problems about the pastor's conduct are raised, then that person becomes the problem. This is the inevitable result of an insular church culture in which the leaders are put on pedestals and the hand-picked board members do not have the courage to question the pastor.
I have had the experience with a church (Good Shepherd Community Church in Scarborough, Ontario) that completely refused to see that it was the pastor that had been causing much of its problems and cared more about the pastor than about the congregation that it claimed to serve. Of course, this resulted in a highly dysfunctional pattern in which there was a continual stream of people butting heads with the pastor, leaving the church, and the core bunch of supporters staying. Of course, this is followed by the pastor and his supporters maligning the people that left and the inevitable "shunning " of the people that left.
I would think that the point of church would be about spiritual growth of the congregation rather than allegiance to certain leaders. I find it very troubling that the pastor can pick "favourites" in the church while at the same time choosing to denigrate others in his congregation. Are we all not part of the same body of Christ and children of God?
I found my experience to be faith destroying. I was completely shocked when I raised matters to both the Board of Elders as well as the Congregational body and got very little response from them. Particularly, given the fact that the situation concerned my cancelled wedding in 2001 and the pastor's awful conduct around that event. My wife and I got married at another church subsequently but I still harbour considerable distrust of church authority. I have tried my best to get by the events and forgive but I still find it very difficult when the church refuses to acknowledge its own poor conduct. I am labelled as someone who has "an axe to grind" with the church and ignored/shunned.
All the best to you and you family. I hope and pray that you folks can move on with your lives.
Thanks and regards,
Message from the Web site - we need your comments - treat this like a blog for the time being - any thought that you can add to the discussion of abuse in the church and how to heal those hurt and those that inflict it. Names will be withheld if requested.TO EMAIL US CLICK HERE
Our overall prayer is that if you have been a victim you will again find a loving and nuturing church home where you can gain back your confidence and be once again an active member of the Christian community. Perhaps the 'home church' option should be considered if there is concern about being part of an established church again.
Remember Jesus never lost the opportunity to expose and ask religious leaders tough questions. Are you prepared to do the same?